Music Mid Majors

Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby chrisco » 24 Apr 2008, 09:47

Take a genre, make sure that genre is popular enough (detroit micro tech strip club music is not big enough sorry bake), and then figure out who were the most influential, respected, and popular bands in the genre. Its kinda subjective, for instance a crap band that sold a billion copies (Nickelback) is not a major because they were not influential or respected.

I think this one is like obscenity, I can't define it, but I know it when I see it [/paraphrasing some famous judge].

For instance the Pixies are a major in alt rock, Dinosaur Jr. is a mid major in alt rock.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby the cheese » 24 Apr 2008, 10:39

mister bacon wrote:
nasty nova wrote:
CourtesyFlush wrote:
Clayton Bigsby wrote:I think we need to figure out some criteria for what qualifies as a mid major. Maybe they need to have had at least a gold album, but no platinum albums? Or maybe double platinum? Some of the bands mentioned here have been, in my mind at least, pretty big. If you've had an album sell more than a million or two albums, i'd say you're major, not just mid major.


I was actually thinking we probably need to establish the 'majors' and work backwards from that criteria. I think most of us would agree that the Beatles, Stones, Zep, Who, Elvis, Dylan[/MTM], the Boss, Fleetwood Mac, AC/DC, Aerosmith, Pearl Jam, etc all qualify as majors. But what are some others? Is A Tribe Called Quest a major? I'd be interested to hear what others have to say about what qualifies as a major (all music genres included).


I think a venue test is a good measure of how "major" an artist/performer is perceived by the masses. For instance, Wu-Tang is one of the all-time great hip-hop acts in terms of product and longevity, but they're performing at Love nightclub this weekend. Not very major. Conversely, Jay-Z is coming to town, and that nigga sold out the Verizon Center.

Does this make Hannah Montana/Miley Cyrus and Bow Wow major? Sadly, it does; but at the same time, a shit ton of people watch Maryland stink up the joint in basketball every year and they're still considered "major".



this method of measurement is seriously flawed. at one point in Wu Tang's careers they were selling out major arenas.. their time is in the past now. and very few hip hop acts ever sell out major arenas.


What about Ghostface as a solo artist? Mid Major all the way, but he's the only member of the Wu-Tang making any critical noise right now, and even then he's lucky to sell 200K
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby Brick Tamland » 24 Apr 2008, 10:45

chrisco wrote:For instance the Pixies are a major in alt rock, Dinosaur Jr. is a mid major in alt rock.


Sorry, but as surprised as I was to find out that the Pixies even had 1 gold album (Doolittle), that does not qualify them as a major. That's mid-major material, and Dino Jr is probably D-II at best. For alt majors, you're looking at Nirvana and the rest of the big grunge acts, plus Green Day, RHCP, Offspring... if you don't consider them "alternative" enough, then you're looking at a genre with no majors.

And I'm with Bacon... Faith No More kicks much ass and is definitely a solid mid-major.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby chrisco » 24 Apr 2008, 10:56

Brick Tamland wrote:
chrisco wrote:For instance the Pixies are a major in alt rock, Dinosaur Jr. is a mid major in alt rock.


Sorry, but as surprised as I was to find out that the Pixies even had 1 gold album (Doolittle), that does not qualify them as a major. That's mid-major material, and Dino Jr is probably D-II at best. For alt majors, you're looking at Nirvana and the rest of the big grunge acts, plus Green Day, RHCP, Offspring... if you don't consider them "alternative" enough, then you're looking at a genre with no majors.

And I'm with Bacon... Faith No More kicks much ass and is definitely a solid mid-major.


Please see what Kurt Cobain has to say regarding the Pixies. If they had not existed, you would have never heard of most 90's alt rock. These guys were enormously influential on Nirvana, Radiohead, and a million other bands from that generation. Also selling 500k records to a college rock crowd was an enormous success. Without the Pixies (and several other bands from that time), there would have never been a market large enough for the 90's grunge bands to have platinum records.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby Briandong79 » 24 Apr 2008, 11:00

Everyone is going to define this differently, so it really is a somewhat pointless argument. However, coming from a non-music person, I had never even heard of The Pixies until I joined this board 3 years ago. That seems to be an argument for classifying them as mid-major.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby Brick Tamland » 24 Apr 2008, 11:01

chrisco wrote:
Brick Tamland wrote:
chrisco wrote:For instance the Pixies are a major in alt rock, Dinosaur Jr. is a mid major in alt rock.


Sorry, but as surprised as I was to find out that the Pixies even had 1 gold album (Doolittle), that does not qualify them as a major. That's mid-major material, and Dino Jr is probably D-II at best. For alt majors, you're looking at Nirvana and the rest of the big grunge acts, plus Green Day, RHCP, Offspring... if you don't consider them "alternative" enough, then you're looking at a genre with no majors.

And I'm with Bacon... Faith No More kicks much ass and is definitely a solid mid-major.


Please see what Kurt Cobain has to say regarding the Pixies. If they had not existed, you would have never heard of most 90's alt rock. These guys were enormously influential on Nirvana, Radiohead, and a million other bands from that generation. Also selling 500k records to a college rock crowd was an enormous success. Without the Pixies (and several other bands from that time), there would have never been a market large enough for the 90's grunge bands to have platinum records.


Major does not equal influence. If it did, a bunch of old blues artists would be majors for influencing Zeppelin and most of rock. See also the Kinks discussion at the beginning of this thread... influenced a lot of rock music but were not a massive commerical success. And the Pixies success in the college arena I don't think had any bearing on "a market large enough for the 90's grunge bands to have platinum records"... there were waaaayyyy more people buying those grunge records than people who'd even heard of the Pixies.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby chrisco » 24 Apr 2008, 11:07

Briandean79 wrote:Everyone is going to define this differently, so it really is a somewhat pointless argument. However, coming from a non-music person, I had never even heard of The Pixies until I joined this board 3 years ago. That seems to be an argument for classifying them as mid-major.


GPIA on the pointless nature of the argument. Music is subjective and where a band stands in your life is even more so.

I would say that most people who really like/liked alt rock and listened to it before Smells Like Teen Spirit are going to agree with me on the Pixies. I wouldn't consider myself qualified to judge a lot of other genres, but I got strong feelings on this. My opinion on it however shouldnt really matter to you, since its A. an opinion, and B. you are not a big fan of that genre.

Anyway, the title of the thread altered the original point of the post which was to shout out bands that were not major stars but that you really loved.
Please keep that in mind if we are going to go forward and keep arguing about who is major and who is not.

UPDATE: Brick my point was without the Pixies you would have never had a Teen Spirit or a grunge market. This is more or less an accepted fact. I have no idea who came up with cargo pants, but I am wearing them. That does not mean the guy who invented them should be discounted because his name means nothing to cargo pants wearers.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby Brick Tamland » 24 Apr 2008, 11:55

chrisco wrote:UPDATE: Brick my point was without the Pixies you would have never had a Teen Spirit or a grunge market. This is more or less an accepted fact. I have no idea who came up with cargo pants, but I am wearing them. That does not mean the guy who invented them should be discounted because his name means nothing to cargo pants wearers.


See, I view the major v. mid-major difference as a commerical one as opposed to influence, largely because the difference between major schools/conferences and mid-majors is money and exposure and that's where the analogy came from. I think that the Replacements (a band I love) were as influential on the bands of the 90s as the Pixies were, but I also consider them to be mid-majors too. It's not a knock to be called a mid-major, just a statement of how big a band really was to mainstream culture.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby someguysomewhere » 24 Apr 2008, 12:30

Brick Tamland wrote:
chrisco wrote:UPDATE: Brick my point was without the Pixies you would have never had a Teen Spirit or a grunge market. This is more or less an accepted fact. I have no idea who came up with cargo pants, but I am wearing them. That does not mean the guy who invented them should be discounted because his name means nothing to cargo pants wearers.


See, I view the major v. mid-major difference as a commerical one as opposed to influence, largely because the difference between major schools/conferences and mid-majors is money and exposure and that's where the analogy came from. I think that the Replacements (a band I love) were as influential on the bands of the 90s as the Pixies were, but I also consider them to be mid-majors too. It's not a knock to be called a mid-major, just a statement of how big a band really was to mainstream culture.


Whoa, bizarre, I was just listening to Achin' to Be on Youtube and thinking of putting them in this thread. The Mats are pretty awesome.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby nova » 24 Apr 2008, 13:24

Brick Tamland wrote:
chrisco wrote:UPDATE: Brick my point was without the Pixies you would have never had a Teen Spirit or a grunge market. This is more or less an accepted fact. I have no idea who came up with cargo pants, but I am wearing them. That does not mean the guy who invented them should be discounted because his name means nothing to cargo pants wearers.


See, I view the major v. mid-major difference as a commerical one as opposed to influence, largely because the difference between major schools/conferences and mid-majors is money and exposure and that's where the analogy came from. I think that the Replacements (a band I love) were as influential on the bands of the 90s as the Pixies were, but I also consider them to be mid-majors too. It's not a knock to be called a mid-major, just a statement of how big a band really was to mainstream culture.


I would liken The Pixies influencing Nirvana to that JUCO coach who taught John Calipari the Drive Nigga Drive offense. Sure, the other guy may have been doing it longer, but Calipari made it mainstream.

As for Ghostface, he's a music mid-major but in terms of hip-hop, he's one of the few doods from the Golden Age who are still relevant.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby chrisco » 14 May 2008, 11:00

Too Much Joy - kinda popular alt rock band around 1990, made borderline bar band music with catchy hooks and sarcastic lyrics, once got LL Cool J to make a cameo in one of their videos. A fun band to see live, even if their guitarist went overboard on his Joe Strummer impersonation. They also couldn't dress worth a damn, but that might have been part of the act.

Seasons in the Son, Crush Story, That's a Lie, Long Haired Guys from England, Donna Everywhere, a decent run of singles for a band that never quite got that popular. Unfortunately YouTube seems to be weak on videos for them, but here is the one with LL:

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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby Colonel Angus » 14 May 2008, 12:23

chrisco wrote:Too Much Joy - kinda popular alt rock band around 1990, made borderline bar band music with catchy hooks and sarcastic lyrics, once got LL Cool J to make a cameo in one of their videos. A fun band to see live, even if their guitarist went overboard on his Joe Strummer impersonation. They also couldn't dress worth a damn, but that might have been part of the act.

Seasons in the Son, Crush Story, That's a Lie, Long Haired Guys from England, Donna Everywhere, a decent run of singles for a band that never quite got that popular. Unfortunately YouTube seems to be weak on videos for them, but here is the one with LL:



Holy shit, I didn't realize another Too Much Joy fan (besides me) existed on this planet. Did you see them live?

(BTW, I have to take issue with you calling them a "mid-major," considering about 99.99% of the general public has never even heard of them.)
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby Iron Mike Sharpe » 14 May 2008, 12:48

Yeah, I'd have to put Too Much Joy in as a D-III team, not a D-I.

The only songs I remembered were Long Haired Guys From England and their cover of That's A Lie. But I'm sure I'd recognize some more songs from the Cereal Killers album if I heard them. I think I still have that disc around somewhere.

I remember freaking out the campus radio station manager whenever I'd play That's A Lie because of the three seconds of dead air when they say "And now this song is done".
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby chrisco » 14 May 2008, 13:17

Worst thread name I ever titled...Mid Major in the sense that they mattered to me more than most bands really should. Agreed that in the larger scale they are D II-III range.

Cereal Killers is a great album.

I saw them once for sure, possibly a second time... Smash A Glass and Cry TOO MUCH JOY, to create you must destroy!

They closed their set with that song, the whole band left the stage, but the mic was on and the guitarist was still playing the riff from offstage. The crowd (which was pretty blotto) kept singing the chorus for a good 5 minutes after the guitarist stopped playing, the mic went dead, and the house lights came on. Good times.

That was one of the best closing gimmicks I have seen, right up there with Ozomatli wandering out of the club/theater/wherever they are playing and keep playing out on the street while everyone follows them out and gathers around.
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Re: Music Mid Majors

Postby Colonel Angus » 14 May 2008, 13:40

"That's a Lie" was a cover? Of whom?

I only have Son Of Sam I Am and I loved it in high school and still listen to it from time to time. They were sort of in the Dead Milkmen/They Might Be Giants alt-joke-rock genre.
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