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Re: Books

Postby The Long Dick of the Law » 30 Aug 2017, 07:09

Dthefritz wrote:As to ldots post: do yo believe that macarthur should have been allowed to nuke China? This is a serious question and not a gotcha thing. You can call out Truman all you want for leading us unprepared into a war, miscalculating the willingness/ability of the Chinese to fight, or being a typical flip-flopping politician. I agree with all that. But at a certain point the choice was full blown war with China (and probably soviet intervention), or "limited war" and stalemate.


I'm somewhat confused because MacArthur was relieved of duty because he put out a communique offering China a ceasefire and stating that stalemate was North Korea/China's best option since they had shown they couldn't conquer and control the Korean peninsula with American/UN forces there. The nuclear weapon "issue" if anything is more of Truman trying to re-write why he did what he did. MacArthur had requested discretion to use tactical to use in case they were pushed back off the Korean peninsula to prevent an ultimate fallback (a Dunkirk minus the successful evacuation) but not to be used to try to recover/improve the situation in Korea. He refused to even listen to proposals on forward deployment of nukes. He came up with plans for potential use of them to seal off the peninsula from Chinese/Soviet reinforcements because the Joint Chiefs had notified him there was the possibility they would use nukes and they sent nukes to the theater of war. MacArthur testified to the Senate he never advocated their use and there is no evidence of him pushing for their use, only of his recommended usage of nukes should the Joint Chiefs/Truman order their use. Truman tried to say MacArthur wanted to use nukes and when MacArthur challenged him on it, Truman then admitted that it was just his [Truman's] personal opinion that MacArthur wanted to use them.
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Re: Books

Postby Dthefritz » 30 Aug 2017, 07:17

The Long Dick of the Law wrote:
Dthefritz wrote:As to ldots post: do yo believe that macarthur should have been allowed to nuke China? This is a serious question and not a gotcha thing. You can call out Truman all you want for leading us unprepared into a war, miscalculating the willingness/ability of the Chinese to fight, or being a typical flip-flopping politician. I agree with all that. But at a certain point the choice was full blown war with China (and probably soviet intervention), or "limited war" and stalemate.


I'm somewhat confused because MacArthur was relieved of duty because he put out a communique offering China a ceasefire and stating that stalemate was North Korea/China's best option since they had shown they couldn't conquer and control the Korean peninsula with American/UN forces there. The nuclear weapon "issue" if anything is more of Truman trying to re-write why he did what he did. MacArthur had requested discretion to use tactical to use in case they were pushed back off the Korean peninsula to prevent an ultimate fallback (a Dunkirk minus the successful evacuation) but not to be used to try to recover/improve the situation in Korea. He refused to even listen to proposals on forward deployment of nukes. He came up with plans for potential use of them to seal off the peninsula from Chinese/Soviet reinforcements because the Joint Chiefs had notified him there was the possibility they would use nukes and they sent nukes to the theater of war. MacArthur testified to the Senate he never advocated their use and there is no evidence of him pushing for their use, only of his recommended usage of nukes should the Joint Chiefs/Truman order their use. Truman tried to say MacArthur wanted to use nukes and when MacArthur challenged him on it, Truman then admitted that it was just his [Truman's] personal opinion that MacArthur wanted to use them.

TY. I knew macarthur didn't want to just nuke china for the hell of it, but I didn't know the full context there.
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Re: Books

Postby Briandong79 » 03 Oct 2017, 08:40

Briandong79 wrote:
I think I'm going to have a fiction rec for you soon. Stay tuned.


My fiction rec is I am Pilgrim, good modern spy story, kind of meandering and surprisingly long for that type of book but I enjoyed it. The end of the story wasn't super satisfying but it was a good read throughout and did wrap everything up, perhaps a bit too neatly.

Just finished Blitzed, about the drug use by the Nazis and Hitler during WWII. Good read, the evidence of Hitler's drug use strikes me as fairly circumstantial but pretty compelling. Lots of meth back then. Most interesting thing for me was just the general timeline of the war as far as Hitler's health, I don't think I fully realized that he was basically a shut in from like 1940 on.
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Re: Books

Postby ctz31 » 03 Oct 2017, 08:42

Briandong79 wrote:
Briandong79 wrote:
I think I'm going to have a fiction rec for you soon. Stay tuned.


My fiction rec is I am Pilgrim, good modern spy story, kind of meandering and surprisingly long for that type of book but I enjoyed it. The end of the story wasn't super satisfying but it was a good read throughout and did wrap everything up, perhaps a bit too neatly.

Just finished Blitzed, about the drug use by the Nazis and Hitler during WWII. Good read, the evidence of Hitler's drug use strikes me as fairly circumstantial but pretty compelling. Lots of meth back then. Most interesting thing for me was just the general timeline of the war as far as Hitler's health, I don't think I fully realized that he was basically a shut in from like 1940 on.


Against my better judgement i will consider taking your fiction rec into.....consideration. Is it as horrible as your non fiction recs such as the chicago world fair in 1919 or the recent war one that i couldnt' get through chapter 4? Dunkirk i believe?
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Re: Books

Postby Briandong79 » 03 Oct 2017, 08:43

ctz31 wrote:
Briandong79 wrote:
Briandong79 wrote:
I think I'm going to have a fiction rec for you soon. Stay tuned.


My fiction rec is I am Pilgrim, good modern spy story, kind of meandering and surprisingly long for that type of book but I enjoyed it. The end of the story wasn't super satisfying but it was a good read throughout and did wrap everything up, perhaps a bit too neatly.

Just finished Blitzed, about the drug use by the Nazis and Hitler during WWII. Good read, the evidence of Hitler's drug use strikes me as fairly circumstantial but pretty compelling. Lots of meth back then. Most interesting thing for me was just the general timeline of the war as far as Hitler's health, I don't think I fully realized that he was basically a shut in from like 1940 on.


Against my better judgement i will consider taking your fiction rec into.....consideration. Is it as horrible as your non fiction recs such as the chicago world fair in 1919 or the recent war one that i couldnt' get through chapter 4? Dunkirk i believe?


Probably worse. (I didn't recommend the Chicago Fair book).
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Re: Books

Postby babylurch » 03 Oct 2017, 08:46

Briandong79 wrote:
Briandong79 wrote:
I think I'm going to have a fiction rec for you soon. Stay tuned.


My fiction rec is I am Pilgrim, good modern spy story, kind of meandering and surprisingly long for that type of book but I enjoyed it. The end of the story wasn't super satisfying but it was a good read throughout and did wrap everything up, perhaps a bit too neatly.

Just finished Blitzed, about the drug use by the Nazis and Hitler during WWII. Good read, the evidence of Hitler's drug use strikes me as fairly circumstantial but pretty compelling. Lots of meth back then. Most interesting thing for me was just the general timeline of the war as far as Hitler's health, I don't think I fully realized that he was basically a shut in from like 1940 on.

You might like A First Rate Madness, which was largely a comparison between the illnesses, mental issues and drugs used by Hitler and JFK. Its been a couple of years since I read it, but it was pretty interesting.
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Re: Books

Postby Iron Mike Sharpe » 12 Oct 2017, 16:28

Read Mr. Smith Goes to Prison: What My Year Behind Bars Taught Me About America's Prison Crisis this week. It was written by an acquaintance of mine who was a former state senator who committed a coverup of his staff breaking a minor election law or two during his run for Congress. Somehow the Feds pursued the case even though he lost the race and he was sentenced to a year in prison.


It's a great, quick read.


The fall from politico to prisoner isn’t necessarily long, but the landing, as Missouri State Senator Jeff Smith learned, is a hard one.

In 2009, Smith pleaded guilty to a seemingly minor charge of campaign malfeasance and earned himself a year and one day in Kentucky’s FCI Manchester. Mr. Smith Goes to Prison is the fish-out-of-water story of his time in the big house; of the people he met there and the things he learned: how to escape the attentions of fellow inmate Cornbread and his friends in the Aryan Brotherhood; what constitutes a prison car and who’s allowed to ride in yours; how to bend and break the rules, whether you’re a prisoner or an officer. And throughout his sentence, the young Senator tracked the greatest crime of all: the deliberate waste of untapped human potential.

Smith saw the power of millions of inmates harnessed as a source of renewable energy for America’s prison-industrial complex, a system that aims to build better criminals instead of better citizens. In Mr. Smith Goes to Prison, he traces the cracks in America’s prison walls, exposing the shortcomings of a racially-based cycle of poverty and crime that sets inmates up to fail. Speaking from inside experience, he offers practical solutions to jailbreak the nation from the financially crushing grip of its own prisons and to jumpstart the rehabilitation of the millions living behind bars.
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Re: Books

Postby mister bacon » 12 Oct 2017, 17:14

I wish white people would care about black people's opinions about the criminal justice system and believe us and our research before a white comes out and says what we've said a thousand times and "people" finally agree. so it goes...
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Re: Books

Postby ctz31 » 13 Oct 2017, 15:05

Iron Mike Sharpe wrote:Read Mr. Smith Goes to Prison: What My Year Behind Bars Taught Me About America's Prison Crisis this week. It was written by an acquaintance of mine who was a former state senator who committed a coverup of his staff breaking a minor election law or two during his run for Congress. Somehow the Feds pursued the case even though he lost the race and he was sentenced to a year in prison.


It's a great, quick read.


The fall from politico to prisoner isn’t necessarily long, but the landing, as Missouri State Senator Jeff Smith learned, is a hard one.

In 2009, Smith pleaded guilty to a seemingly minor charge of campaign malfeasance and earned himself a year and one day in Kentucky’s FCI Manchester. Mr. Smith Goes to Prison is the fish-out-of-water story of his time in the big house; of the people he met there and the things he learned: how to escape the attentions of fellow inmate Cornbread and his friends in the Aryan Brotherhood; what constitutes a prison car and who’s allowed to ride in yours; how to bend and break the rules, whether you’re a prisoner or an officer. And throughout his sentence, the young Senator tracked the greatest crime of all: the deliberate waste of untapped human potential.

Smith saw the power of millions of inmates harnessed as a source of renewable energy for America’s prison-industrial complex, a system that aims to build better criminals instead of better citizens. In Mr. Smith Goes to Prison, he traces the cracks in America’s prison walls, exposing the shortcomings of a racially-based cycle of poverty and crime that sets inmates up to fail. Speaking from inside experience, he offers practical solutions to jailbreak the nation from the financially crushing grip of its own prisons and to jumpstart the rehabilitation of the millions living behind bars.


Your friend is a worthless unknown. He coulda been a famous martyr if he called bullshit on the investigation and murked hisself on live tv.

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Re: Books

Postby MisterTambourineMan » 30 Oct 2017, 13:05

Thinking of ordering this

The Man from the Train: The Solving of a Century-Old Serial Killer Mystery

Using unprecedented, dramatically compelling sleuthing techniques, legendary statistician and baseball writer Bill James applies his analytical acumen to crack an unsolved century-old mystery surrounding one of the deadliest serial killers in American history.Between 1898 and 1912, families across the country were bludgeoned in their sleep with the blunt side of an axe. Jewelry and valuables were left in plain sight, bodies were piled together, faces covered with cloth. Some of these cases, like the infamous Villisca, Iowa, murders, received national attention. But few people believed the crimes were related. And fewer still would realize that all of these families lived within walking distance to a train station.When celebrated baseball statistician and true crime expert Bill James first learned about these horrors, he began to investigate others that might fit the same pattern. Applying the same know-how he brings to his legendary baseball analysis, he empirically determined which crimes were committed by the same person.


Anyone heard of this one?
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Re: Books

Postby The Long Dick of the Law » 30 Oct 2017, 13:06

Umm, people can feel free to enlighten me, but when did Bill James become a TRU crime expert?
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Re: Books

Postby MisterTambourineMan » 30 Oct 2017, 13:06

The Long Dick of the Law wrote:Umm, people can feel free to enlighten me, but when did Bill James become a TRU crime expert?


I was also perplexed by that one....
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Re: Books

Postby Rodney Farva » 30 Oct 2017, 13:09

maybe he saw an opportunity when patton oswalt’s wife died
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Re: Books

Postby SouthernYokel » 30 Oct 2017, 13:11

MisterTambourineMan wrote:Thinking of ordering this

The Man from the Train: The Solving of a Century-Old Serial Killer Mystery

Using unprecedented, dramatically compelling sleuthing techniques, legendary statistician and baseball writer Bill James applies his analytical acumen to crack an unsolved century-old mystery surrounding one of the deadliest serial killers in American history.Between 1898 and 1912, families across the country were bludgeoned in their sleep with the blunt side of an axe. Jewelry and valuables were left in plain sight, bodies were piled together, faces covered with cloth. Some of these cases, like the infamous Villisca, Iowa, murders, received national attention. But few people believed the crimes were related. And fewer still would realize that all of these families lived within walking distance to a train station.When celebrated baseball statistician and true crime expert Bill James first learned about these horrors, he began to investigate others that might fit the same pattern. Applying the same know-how he brings to his legendary baseball analysis, he empirically determined which crimes were committed by the same person.


Anyone heard of this one?


to me, this says Bill James has been researching how to become a great serial killer.


also: this dude had a perfectly good axe and chose to bludgeon people with the wrong side of it. that's a special kind of sociopath.
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Re: Books

Postby Goose » 30 Oct 2017, 13:40

Rodney Farva wrote:maybe he saw an opportunity when patton oswalt’s wife died


Capitalizing on market inefficiencies, that's what makes him the king of arbitrage.

Briandong79 wrote:My fiction rec is I am Pilgrim, good modern spy story, kind of meandering and surprisingly long for that type of book but I enjoyed it. The end of the story wasn't super satisfying but it was a good read throughout and did wrap everything up, perhaps a bit too neatly.


I haven't gotten very far, and it was going along pretty good until I got to the backstory. "I was the smartest guy in the world, going to the best college in America before being recruited into the secretest organization in the US government, where I became the greatest murder investigator ever and wrote the amazingest book on CSI work that everyone talked about in hushed tones the world over and then..." Alright, just get back to the murdered chick in the bathtub.

The Long Dick of the Law wrote:
Dthefritz wrote:As to ldots post: do yo believe that macarthur should have been allowed to nuke China? This is a serious question and not a gotcha thing. You can call out Truman all you want for leading us unprepared into a war, miscalculating the willingness/ability of the Chinese to fight, or being a typical flip-flopping politician. I agree with all that. But at a certain point the choice was full blown war with China (and probably soviet intervention), or "limited war" and stalemate.


I'm somewhat confused because MacArthur was relieved of duty because he put out a communique offering China a ceasefire and stating that stalemate was North Korea/China's best option since they had shown they couldn't conquer and control the Korean peninsula with American/UN forces there. The nuclear weapon "issue" if anything is more of Truman trying to re-write why he did what he did. MacArthur had requested discretion to use tactical to use in case they were pushed back off the Korean peninsula to prevent an ultimate fallback (a Dunkirk minus the successful evacuation) but not to be used to try to recover/improve the situation in Korea. He refused to even listen to proposals on forward deployment of nukes. He came up with plans for potential use of them to seal off the peninsula from Chinese/Soviet reinforcements because the Joint Chiefs had notified him there was the possibility they would use nukes and they sent nukes to the theater of war. MacArthur testified to the Senate he never advocated their use and there is no evidence of him pushing for their use, only of his recommended usage of nukes should the Joint Chiefs/Truman order their use. Truman tried to say MacArthur wanted to use nukes and when MacArthur challenged him on it, Truman then admitted that it was just his [Truman's] personal opinion that MacArthur wanted to use them.


This is really fun to read in Sam Kinison's voice.
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